Jimbo

Dealing correctly with issues

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What do you guys do with complaints?

if the car is within the first 30 days and you get moans about any kind of issues - oil leaks, drop links, misfires, coolant leaks, etc etc 

do you usually pass over to the warranty company and ask them to step in or try and sort repairs yourself?

i know the first 30 days are the main part and then 1 month to 6 months also. 

Just wondered how the majority deal with issues as/when they arise?

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Also, if you guys do offer a refund in those 30 days or even in the first 6 months, do you take any money off for mileage and wear and tear? Charging 40p per mile etc?

and if the new owner has been to a garage to have inspections etc do you also cover those costs or are you only having to offer a full refund of the initial purchase price and take the car back?

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I usually end up sorting it for no charge I like to see customers come back and get plenty of business when it comes to next mot etc having workshop and mechanic on site although don' cover wear and tear like clutch springs starter etc always nice to provide an after sales service though save them going to trading standards.

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Jimbo, 

In all reality 30 days issues you should sort yourself and not expect warranty company to sort, their argument would be the car should not have some these issues in such a short time after delivery if the car was inspected/prepared correctly prior to sale.

It also depends on how you want to build your business going forward, I don't know what price range/vehicles you sell, however my philosophy has always been to look after the customer and build a business, if you look after them from day one, sort out issues the chances are they will return / refer others to you. 

If you try to simply pass  them on to the warranty company, some of these items i.e oil leak' type' will not be covered anyway and the customer will think the warranty isn't worth the paper its written on and still come shouting back to you. 

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We get a maximum of one complaint like this a month, we generally just sort it, we get unreasonable customers sometimes though and that's a different story. After 14 days the warranty company deal with most issues, which either gets the problem fixed or contributes the lion's share of the cost.

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What do you guys do with complaints?

(treat this as an opportunity to show them why they bought from you in the first place and not from the guy out the back of the petrol station at 9pm step up and sort the fault promptly a simple fix coil pack sump gasket what ever it is will be the cheapest form of advertising you will ever have)

if the car is within the first 30 days and you get moans about any kind of issues - oil leaks, drop links, misfires, coolant leaks, etc etc 

(take your faults as you listed them, oil leaks well these happen from time to time on older stuff even more so but part of your pdi you should have been under the car checking for obvious signs of things starting to go wrong, drop links again don’t just fail unless you live on a mountain with pot holes the size of craters should have been noticed early, misfires well coil packs plugs and leads have a mind of there own not a lot you can do there, coolant leaks yikes !

do you usually pass over to the warranty company and ask them to step in or try and sort repairs yourself?

(for me dealing with stuff sub 5k I do all my own repairs in house never needed a company)

Looking at last years come backs the biggest was the c1 /107 with clutch faults, so do we stop selling me hell no, it’s the kind of car that attracts first time drivers who are going to be hard on the clutch, the peddles are stupidly close so even I sometime ride the clutch with my big hoofs, but we spin it around change the clutch same day if its done a lot of miles and been driven hard we ask for a contribution, I have a massive percentage of those people coming back next year to upgrade to something bigger once there insurance comes down, if I told them to take a running jump with there clutch faults I very much doubt I would have hardly anyone back.

Now what you have to remember is everyone runs there business different the above is how we operate doesn’t make it right doesn’t make it wrong but works for us.

 

 

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Thanks guys. If client lives too far away to fix yourself would u just offer a full refund? 

What about if they have to pay for diagnosing do u still just offer full refund of sale price? Not refund plus diagnosing costs?

do u subtract anything for use? Like mileage?

 

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2 hours ago, Jimbo said:

Thanks guys. If client lives too far away to fix yourself would u just offer a full refund? 

What about if they have to pay for diagnosing do u still just offer full refund of sale price? Not refund plus diagnosing costs?

do u subtract anything for use? Like mileage?

 

cant help there sorry, one of the main advantages of selling Fiestas and Clios no one wants to travel hundreds of miles to buy them,sure someone more up to date will comment soon

 

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10 hours ago, justina3 said:

What do you guys do with complaints?

 

(treat this as an opportunity to show them why they bought from you in the first place and not from the guy out the back of the petrol station at 9pm step up and sort the fault promptly a simple fix coil pack sump gasket what ever it is will be the cheapest form of advertising you will ever have)

 

if the car is within the first 30 days and you get moans about any kind of issues - oil leaks, drop links, misfires, coolant leaks, etc etc 

 

(take your faults as you listed them, oil leaks well these happen from time to time on older stuff even more so but part of your pdi you should have been under the car checking for obvious signs of things starting to go wrong, drop links again don’t just fail unless you live on a mountain with pot holes the size of craters should have been noticed early, misfires well coil packs plugs and leads have a mind of there own not a lot you can do there, coolant leaks yikes !

do you usually pass over to the warranty company and ask them to step in or try and sort repairs yourself?

 

(for me dealing with stuff sub 5k I do all my own repairs in house never needed a company)

 

Looking at last years come backs the biggest was the c1 /107 with clutch faults, so do we stop selling me hell no, it’s the kind of car that attracts first time drivers who are going to be hard on the clutch, the peddles are stupidly close so even I sometime ride the clutch with my big hoofs, but we spin it around change the clutch same day if its done a lot of miles and been driven hard we ask for a contribution, I have a massive percentage of those people coming back next year to upgrade to something bigger once there insurance comes down, if I told them to take a running jump with there clutch faults I very much doubt I would have hardly anyone back.

 

Now what you have to remember is everyone runs there business different the above is how we operate doesn’t make it right doesn’t make it wrong but works for us.

 

 

 

 

 

100%...agree. We do our own warranty ( breakdown agreement ),we must have saved a fortune over the years.Another benefit is,our guys get repeat punters week in week out.

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Jimbo, you need to make sure you do the right prep and checks prior to the car going out, a new MOT and PDI. My cars are mot'd and independently PDI'd. If there are faults, I state them in my video and the invoice / PDI as it forms part of the contract.

The way I see it is very clear, I tend to sell cars which are prestige, high mileage and 10+ years in age, with this age of vehicle "wear n tear" should be expected and the expectations should be very very different to newer cars which haven't been to the moon and back.... The CRA works on a sliding scale, age mileage condition and price paid and the expectations should be befitting of the above.

At the end of the day a car is just a machine and they can break at any time, irrespective of whatever prep. My job is to make sure the car is right on collection and that the customer is happy and confirms this in writing. I also educate them that anything that constitutes "wear n tear" is their responsibility to repair. 

I do not offer a warranty / insurance policy, because you are just asking for endless hassle. To answer your question, if I have a problem customer within 30 days who has ignored the above, I tell them to return it me to me for a "statutory inspection" with the reiteration that "wear n tear" is not covered. It's all about expectations and education, if you are transparent and explain your stance and your reasoning behind your stance they will respect you.....

 

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Thanks again much appreciated. 

So the absolute most you can do is offer them to return for a full refund?

would you cover mechanic costs they have incurred too? What about charging for mileage theyve put on the car?

With some buyers it seems best to unwind the deal and find a more suitable new owner!!!

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46 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

Thanks again much appreciated. 

So the absolute most you can do is offer them to return for a full refund?

would you cover mechanic costs they have incurred too? What about charging for mileage theyve put on the car?

With some buyers it seems best to unwind the deal and find a more suitable new owner!!!

mechanic costs ? no, there responsibility is to return the car to you for inspection, why would you pay for example a company that offers a "free safety check" for your customer to be then faced with a bill for some fitter on a bonus scheme ?

mileage, if they're taking the piss, and you genuinely believe your being had, then YES. otherwise no, refund, move on.

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1 hour ago, have a word with the wife said:

mechanic costs ? no, there responsibility is to return the car to you for inspection, why would you pay for example a company that offers a "free safety check" for your customer to be then faced with a bill for some fitter on a bonus scheme ?

mileage, if they're taking the piss, and you genuinely believe your being had, then YES. otherwise no, refund, move on.

Cool thanks. So if a repair is either not possible as theyre too far away and you dont want to pay a ridiculous price from their local garage you’re within your rights to refuse their bill and just offer a refund and close the issue off? You cant be forced to pay a bill from their garage as you always have a fall back of offering a full refund 

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Also what would you do if a repair bill/quote comes in that you think is just too high? Or a repair you’re not sure is quite as large as has been made out?

if you’re too far away to have your own mechanic look at it but werent happy with your customers mechanic quote for proposed work what would you do?

these are fairly common issues we hear about in the trade and its good to know where you stand. Customer service is v important to us 

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1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

Also what would you do if a repair bill/quote comes in that you think is just too high? Or a repair you’re not sure is quite as large as has been made out?

if you’re too far away to have your own mechanic look at it but werent happy with your customers mechanic quote for proposed work what would you do?

these are fairly common issues we hear about in the trade and its good to know where you stand. Customer service is v important to us 

crunch the numbers you could spend ages stressing about this and that sometimes you have to take a hit, take the hit and move in, if its once in a bluemoon then i would just take the easy option and move on, if it is happening often then i would look at the whole business model.

For example i know someone who has a chain of small corner shops he knows stealing is part of the daily culture so he does what he can to stop it but then has a 5% allowance for theft if one store moves above 5% it gets looked at, his point is he could spend 20% of the shops profit stopping 5% theft it doesnt add up

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2 hours ago, Jimbo said:

Also what would you do if a repair bill/quote comes in that you think is just too high? Or a repair you’re not sure is quite as large as has been made out?

if you’re too far away to have your own mechanic look at it but werent happy with your customers mechanic quote for proposed work what would you do?

these are fairly common issues we hear about in the trade and its good to know where you stand. Customer service is v important to us 

Generally does not happen because it is explained that using the warranty on the vehicle involves contacting us or the warranty company. No authorisation no payout.

And no I wouldn't refund someone and pay their garage diagnostic bill who have ripped it to shreds as the offer of returning it to the place of purchase would have been made available.

 

Every once in a while you will get a customer who tries it on, goes and gets work done and sends you a bill with no authorisation, communication or anything else. These customers are dealt with very firmly.

 

Its all about arse covering in this job unfortunately, you should learn as you go along, we all do.

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Do you have a case in mind Jimbo or just gathering info, a lot of what your asking should be covered in your t&c's 

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14 hours ago, Arfur Dealy said:

Jimbo, you need to make sure you do the right prep and checks prior to the car going out, a new MOT and PDI. My cars are mot'd and independently PDI'd. If there are faults, I state them in my video and the invoice / PDI as it forms part of the contract.

The way I see it is very clear, I tend to sell cars which are prestige, high mileage and 10+ years in age, with this age of vehicle "wear n tear" should be expected and the expectations should be very very different to newer cars which haven't been to the moon and back.... The CRA works on a sliding scale, age mileage condition and price paid and the expectations should be befitting of the above.

At the end of the day a car is just a machine and they can break at any time, irrespective of whatever prep. My job is to make sure the car is right on collection and that the customer is happy and confirms this in writing. I also educate them that anything that constitutes "wear n tear" is their responsibility to repair. 

I do not offer a warranty / insurance policy, because you are just asking for endless hassle. To answer your question, if I have a problem customer within 30 days who has ignored the above, I tell them to return it me to me for a "statutory inspection" with the reiteration that "wear n tear" is not covered. It's all about expectations and education, if you are transparent and explain your stance and your reasoning behind your stance they will respect you.....

 

Whilst I really wish I could operate like this, I could never get away with it. What would you do if a customers car needed injector seals, stretched timing chain, abs pump was faulty, etc? In my experience, there are endless amounts of wear n tear issues and so many people seem to lose all rational when a light or a defect presents itself. I operate my own warranty, which lists what is covered and what is not, but id guess 70% of my come back work is stuff that is not covered under my warranty.

Just last week I had to get glowplugs changed on a car I sold for £3250 because the car was struggling to start in the cold and the customer was threatening to back the car after having it for 29 days.

You can be as clear as possible at the point of sale, but as soon as anything comes to light that requires a customer to part with a penny, all that goes out the window. Its like they have never heard of cars getting repair work done before.

Having been to court on several occasions, 50 quid here and there is a lot less stressful. Just my 2 cents........

Edited by MSP Motors
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totally agree msp, they do lost the plot over sometimes / most of the time i mean, this chain of thought the customers have really does steer what i buy these days

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5 hours ago, justina3 said:

Do you have a case in mind Jimbo or just gathering info, a lot of what your asking should be covered in your t&c's 

Just info for now as touch wood only ever had 1 car back that was a dirt cheap part ex. Never again

 

i just want to know what legally we need to do when these things arise. We want to do things right and not have the piss taken by either side. 

Some clients u can tell will be calling about every little thing. 

I just wondered if you should sometimes just offer part payment to fix problems or just say bring car back and refund amount and find a better buyer!!

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1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

 

I just wondered if you should sometimes just offer part payment to fix problems or just say bring car back and refund amount and find a better buyer!!

Yes. 

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7 hours ago, MSP Motors said:

Whilst I really wish I could operate like this, I could never get away with it. What would you do if a customers car needed injector seals, stretched timing chain, abs pump was faulty, etc? In my experience, there are endless amounts of wear n tear issues and so many people seem to lose all rational when a light or a defect presents itself. I operate my own warranty, which lists what is covered and what is not, but id guess 70% of my come back work is stuff that is not covered under my warranty.

Just last week I had to get glowplugs changed on a car I sold for £3250 because the car was struggling to start in the cold and the customer was threatening to back the car after having it for 29 days.

You can be as clear as possible at the point of sale, but as soon as anything comes to light that requires a customer to part with a penny, all that goes out the window. Its like they have never heard of cars getting repair work done before.

Having been to court on several occasions, 50 quid here and there is a lot less stressful. Just my 2 cents........

MSP, don't get me wrong :) I always try to help my customers if they are polite and reasonable. I don't insist it must be returned if they are miles away unless they are being unreasonable, I just reserve the right to ask them too. The thing is, I prep well and rarely have problems, if a car has an issue within 30 days I just don't invite them to return it to me for repair. If an injector seal decides its going to chuff within 30 days on a 140k 12 years old car, it is clearly wear n tear. 

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The last repair I paid for was for was an  EGR cooler in December which let go with a cloud of white steam. Very dramatic for the customer...

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8 hours ago, justina3 said:

totally agree msp, they do lost the plot over sometimes / most of the time i mean, this chain of thought the customers have really does steer what i buy these days

We've had a typical one today; 

Five months into owning a twelve year old car and a caliper has seized which apparently is our fault, it was apparently 'seized and faulty at the point of sale' (yep they've been doing their CRA homework) nothing to do with parking by the sea during winter and infrequently using the car. Oh and their friend that works at the garage the car is at has quoted a mere £600 to remedy it but won't even supply the current mileage on the car so far.

I think it was within 30 seconds that the threats to tell everyone what cowboys we are and take this to the highest levels were made.

...the worst thing is I tried so hard not to sell it to them knowing what the outcome would be but they went ahead anyway.

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Wow. Idiots are everywhere!

Can’t see them having any recourse at all and would politely tell them where to go.  

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